Welcome, Nynke and Wytse Willem. You are here today to tell us something about the Frisian language. I look forward to hearing your story. Could you introduce yourselves to our readers?

Nynke: Yes, of course. My name is Nynke Pel. I am 27 years old. I grew up in the Dutch province of Friesland, but when I went to university, I moved to Leiden. I currently work for a non-profit organisation that fights against inequality of opportunity amongst young people. Furthermore, I am studying at the pabo (teachers’ college for primary education). I hope to graduate soon and to be in charge of my own class, as a teacher myself. I also studied Middle Eastern Studies at the University of Leiden. During my studies, I learnt a little bit of Farsi, but the languages I really speak fluently are Frisian, Dutch, and English.

Wytse Willem: And I am Wytse Willem Pel. I am 22 years old, and I also live in Leiden. I study Linguistics and Classical Languages at Leiden University. So, during my studies, I learn ancient Greek and Latin. Additionally, I speak Frisian, Dutch, and English fluently, just like Nynke.

Thank you very much. I read that ‘Frisian’ actually refers to several related languages, namely Saterland Frisian, North Frisian, and West Frisian. You grew up with West Frisian that is spoken in the Dutch province of Friesland. Could you tell us more about these three languages?

Nynke: Yes, of course. There is indeed ‘the Frisian language’ and when most people think of this, they actually mean the West Frisian language that is spoken in the Dutch province of Friesland. Long ago, there was an ethnic group called ‘the Frisians’ who lived along the coast of Denmark, Germany, and the Netherlands. They all spoke a very similar language. In some regions, traces of this remain, but because these regions have been isolated from each other for a long time, the languages have continued to develop separately. Therefore, I am not sure whether we would still be able to understand these other languages nowadays.

So, the three languages have their origin in the same language, but eventually they grew apart...

Wytse Willem: Yes, that is right. The area where the Frisian language was spoken used to be much larger, but nowadays only small, isolated regions remain. The large area fell apart hundreds of years ago. Since then, Frisian that was spoken in that large area, has diverged into the current variants. In the East of present-day Friesland, Saxon has had a lot of influence. In this area, Saxon was increasingly used instead of Frisian, until the area was almost completely dominated by the Saxon dialect.

Saxon. Could you explain to the readers what this means exactly?

Wytse Willem: Yes, but it is somewhat confusing. First of all, there are the Anglo-Saxons. They migrated from Germany and Denmark to England and Friesland around the year five hundred. The language they spoke would form the foundation for the English and Frisian languages. Saxon —which, from the late Middle Ages onwards, eliminated Frisian from the Eastern area of present-day Friesland— was the language of the Saxons who stayed behind in Germany. Thus, the language of the Saxons first played a role in the emergence of Frisian and later in its disappearance.

Where did the Frisians originate from and how did the Frisian language actually emerge?

Wytse Willem: Then we have to go back to the year two hundred. In that period the sea level kept rising, so anyone who lived along the coasts of the Netherlands eventually had to move. Around the year four hundred the coastal area was therefore quite deserted. The Angles lived in Southern Denmark, and the Saxons populated the area of Northern Germany. Since there was overpopulation in these areas, these Anglo-Saxons were forced to find new land. At the same time, the Roman Empire fell. The Romans left England, and from this period onwards many Angles and Saxons migrated to England. Some of them ended up in Friesland on their way to England and decided to stay there. 

Could the Anglo-Saxons get there because the sea level had started to drop?

Wytse Willem: Yes. The interesting thing is that the Anglo-Saxons adopted the name ‘Frisians’. This means that along the coast there was still a small group remaining who called themselves ‘Frisians’. The Anglo-Saxons did not say ‘we are called Saxons’ or ‘we are called Angles’, but they did refer to themselves as Frisians afterwards.

How is it possible that the Frisian language has been preserved, and has not been absorbed by the Dutch language?

Wytse Willem: That is a very difficult question to answer. Until the late Middle Ages, Frisian existed within an independent country. What I mean by this, is that it was not ruled by a duke or a count. The Dutch ‘nation state’ is not yet so old. Maybe there has not been enough time for it thus far.

Nynke: It might happen one day.

Wytse Willem: Who knows. In the past there was no universal language either; many different dialects existed at that time. It was only until the seventeenth century that people wanted to create one nation and one language. Therefore, in that period, there was no language that could completely replace Frisian.

Nynke: Yes, at that time there was not one region or one country which said, ‘the same language has to be spoken everywhere in this country’. In the last centuries you see that Frisian has been more subjected to Dutch. For example, Frisian has a lot of long vowels. Once every few years, academics conduct research in order to understand how long those sounds remain in their uses of language in daily life. You can observe that the pronunciation of Frisian words becomes shorter every ten years. This shows that there is an influence of the Dutch language.

Do you think Frisian will ever be replaced by Dutch?

Nynke: That is difficult to say. In any case, I do not think this will happen in the short term. Personally, I think the diversity of languages is very beautiful, so I would find it a pity if Frisian were to disappear. Many people consider Frisian as an important part of their identity; therefore I don’t think it will disappear in an instant.

Wytse Willem: Yes, I think it will take a few hundred years at least. A language does not disappear from one day to the next. It is a very gradual process. More and more loanwords will be borrowed and the syntax will keep changing little by little. There are Frisian words that might exist for another eight hundred years, but in the year 2500 only 10 percent of the words might still be originally Frisian.

Nynke: I have the impression that Frisian is losing ground. For instance, my grandfather was taught in Frisian in primary school, but our primary education was in Dutch. Moreover, you see that Frisian parents raise their children in Dutch nowadays, because they do not see the use of Frisian anymore. At the same time, Frisian still has a reasonable status, it is not a dying language like Gaelic in Ireland for example.

You also mentioned that the Frisian language is important for the identity of the Frisians. What other factors contribute to this identity?

Nynke: I think the language, the flag, and also the Frisian landscape combined with its tranquillity are important for the Frisian identity. The province of Friesland has a beautiful landscape with lakes and vast pastures. The flag also plays an important role. For instance, when I travel abroad, I always have a Frisian flag attached to my backpack, and I recognise this among fellow Frisians. Many people put a sticker of the flag on their car, for example. I also own a knitted jumper with the Frisian flag on it. When I wore it once in Australia, people stopped by the road, turned down their car windows and said. ‘Oh, how beautiful, how beautiful!’ So, it does run deep.

Wytse Willem: Yes, I think so too. I wonder how old the Frisian identity actually is. I do know that there are Frisian texts from the Middle Ages in which the Frisian language was already being addressed. In those days the idea was already prevalent that ‘we have a language that is different from Dutch’, or the respective language that was spoken in the Netherlands at the time. Apparently, in these texts, they already referred to the Frisian language as a part of their own identity, but the concept of cultural identity that we now know of only emerged around the nineteenth century.

Do you think Frisians are prouder of their origin, language, and province than Dutch citizens from other Dutch provinces?

Nynke: Yes, I do think Frisians are prouder of their own province than many other Dutch citizens. If you ask people, ‘Where do you come from?’, then many Dutch citizens only identify themselves with the city they grew up in. Many Frisians would answer, ‘I am from Friesland!’ They really identify themselves with the Frisian province. You could compare it to Catalans or Basques who are also very proud of their own language and culture.

Wytse Willem: Yes, Frisians are indeed very proud of their origin. Many Frisians also say, ‘We are descendants of the Vikings’ or ‘the Dutch language emerged from ours’. That is not true, but there is this general belief that the Frisians are an ancient people.

Nynke: In Friesland, for instance, the national anthem plays a bigger role than in other provinces. What I find interesting is that at the beginning of the nineteenth century nationalistic sentiments arose all over Europe. The Frisian national anthem and various Frisian sports such as Frisian handball (keatsen) were connected to the Frisian identity during this nationalistic wave. People sometimes think that handball is an ancient Frisian sport, but that is not correct. The idea that these things really belong to the Frisian identity is actually a bit artificial.

Wytse Willem: Yes, it has a lot to do with nationalism, because then we started to determine things as ‘being really Frisian’. During that time, more attention was raised to the Frisian language. Writers started to collect Frisian fairy tales like the Grimm brothers did in Germany.

Frisian is also recognised as an official language within Friesland, while the dialects in the other Dutch provinces have not received this status within their own respective province. What is your opinion about that?

Nynke: Frisian is indeed a recognised language within the province of Friesland. For instance, you are allowed to use Frisian in court, which is not allowed with the dialects in other regions. I think it is valuable that Frisian, which is classified as a language, is also recognised as such. Whenever a language is recognised, funding is allocated to it and policy can be made for it. For example, the province of Friesland offers Frisian-language education at primary schools in the region. I would not say that only Frisian should have that kind of status. Should other dialects eventually be classified as a language within the Netherlands, then I think they deserve that reputation too. In that case I think they ought to receive some attention, recognition, and funding as well. 

Wytse Willem: Yes, I agree.

How is the distinction made between a language and a dialect? How do you define something as a language?

Wytse Willem: I find it difficult to judge, but I think one criterion is that older language variants must have been written. Many Dutch dialects do not have medieval texts, as far as I know, but Frisian does. During my studies of linguistics, this question was also raised and then they replied, ‘A language is a dialect with an army and a navy’. So, a dialect can be called a language when it has some kind of political weight. Maybe Frisian has had just enough of that weight, but other dialects presumably do not.

You grew up with both languages. How was that for you?

Nynke: Our parents raised us in Frisian, which we then consider as our mother tongue. They never communicated with us in Dutch and we solely spoke Frisian with the rest of the family as well. When I mention this to other people, they often think it is strange. I think I learnt Dutch through my environment. For example, at the day care, through friends, and through television. I believe it is important that a child, apart from Frisian, also has the opportunity to learn the Dutch language. Otherwise, the child could develop a language deficiency in Dutch.

So, at home you only spoke Frisian, but in your environment many people also speak Dutch. How has it been for you to switch between these two languages?

Nynke: I could, and still can, switch quickly between the two languages. Halfway through a sentence I can also ‘oergean yn it Frysk, dat makket my neat út.’ (‘Switch to Frisian, it makes no difference to me’). Sometimes I still mix up sentences, for example when I use Frisian expressions while speaking Dutch.

Wytse Willem: I have always been able to switch between the two languages with ease. I do not necessarily recall whether I had a bilingual upbringing per say. This realisation actually came later. As a child I was not aware of it, so it never caused any problems.

Most people in Friesland only speak Frisian, but you can write it too...

Wytse Willem: Yes, I have a great interest in our language. I found it important to be able to read and write my own native language. Dutch is mostly written the way it is pronounced, but Frisian is often written differently than how it is pronounced. Frisian also has many more punctuation marks and accents, such as circumflexes and acute accents. This makes writing and reading Frisian quite difficult. Therefore, there are many people who speak Frisian, but cannot read or write it very well.

Nynke: Due to the rise of social media, the younger generation of Frisians have started to write more Frisian. I recently watched a documentary about this on the Frisian television channel Omrop Fryslân. There is a revival of the Frisian language through social media, but this comes at the expense of correct spelling. The younger people write Frisian the way it is pronounced. Opinions differ on this trend. Some people think it is an undesirable development, because the spelling rules are not used properly. There are also people who think it is a good thing, because young people do keep the language alive. All in all, I think it is an interesting discussion.

Yes, it is interesting. I think there is something to be said for both sides, also because the language is an important part of the Frisian identity. Many people probably think it is important that it is preserved and does not change too much.

Nynke: Yes, that it does not change. But also that it does not adapt itself to Dutch. The younger generation of Frisians continuously apply the Dutch grammar rules while texting each other. I am not quite sure what my opinion about this is.  However, I do think it is admirable that many Frisian youngsters communicate with each other in Frisian. Even if it means that it is not spelt correctly. Nowadays, Omrop Fryslân also has an Instagram page in which they post many Frisian memes. This is a trend amongst young people. I think it is great, because these are the things that keep the language alive.

Do you have tips for someone who wants to learn Frisian? 

Nynke: There is an organisation called ‘Afûk’ based in Leeuwarden, the capital of Friesland. This organisation offers Frisian language courses at various levels. Our mother recently decided (at age 55) to take a course in Frisian, so that in addition to reading it, she will also be able to write it well. Nowadays, Frisian is also part of Google Translate. That was an initiative in which many Frisians were offered to help along with the translations of Frisian words and sentences. So many Frisians did, which resulted in the option to translate words from or into Frisian using Google Translate. This might be a fun introduction to the language.

Wytse Willem: You can also find many Frisian texts and videos on the website of the Frisian television channel Omrop Fryslân. 

Are there also initiatives to preserve the Frisian language?

Nynke: Yes, there is an umbrella organisation of speakers of minority languages in Europe. A Frisian delegation is part of this. Furthermore, you have the ‘Fryske Akademy’ based in Leeuwarden. This academy researches the Frisian language. Their findings can make a positive contribution to the preservation of the Frisian language.

Lastly, do you have a final message for our readers?

Nynke: In history there have been several attempts to have everyone speak a universal language, for example the artificial language Esperanto. I would like to emphasize that I appreciate the diversity of languages, also because it is part of a certain culture and identity. I hope that we can continue to preserve these languages. I would like to say to everyone, ‘Be proud of the language you speak, promote it, and pass it on’. If I were to have children, I would raise them in Frisian, most definitely.

Wytse Willem: Yes, I agree with that. And I think this is also true for dialects. A dialect is not less beautiful because it is not called a language. I would say, ‘Pass it on to your children’. Because yes, I am happy to be Frisian. 

I think that is a great conclusion. Thank you for sharing your story!